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Netscape 6 Preview Release

CmdrTaco posted more than 14 years ago | from the here-it-is-kids dept.

Mozilla 481

deadpixel writes, "The Netscape 6 preview has been released. Really small download. No more Mozilla, sniff. " Kinda sad, but I think I'll use the Mozilla icon for this just as a tribute ;)

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Why is this sad? (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1149968)

I don't get it--this is *exactly* what was supposed to happen. Mozilla is the open-source tree, and Netscape periodically snapshots the tree and releases that as their next version.

The only thing I don't like about it is not having the exact source for the Netscape snapshot after they've monkeyed with it.

Re:Ramblings on N6 (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 14 years ago | (#1149970)

Chances are that's tweakable in Mozilla, just like 4.x. All the keyboard shortcuts are changeable in NS 4.x (Mandrake, in particular, changes them to be consistent with conventional unix use). There's a file Netscape.ad that comes with Netscape UNIX tarballs that can be edited and then copied to /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/app-defaults/Netscape

Re:Standards compliance (1)

seppy (2431) | more than 14 years ago | (#1149989)

You're way off. The whole point of mozilla was standards compliance. In fact there is a chart comparing the compliance of the various browsers at the netscape download site. Why don't you look at it?

`Internet keywords' (1)

thomasd (3336) | more than 14 years ago | (#1149998)

I can't comment on IE5 (hardly ever used it), but Netscaoe Classic version 4.5+ does something similar -- they call it Internet Keywords. But it's easy to disable in the browser preferences. Same goes for the `Smart Browsing': this tells the Netcentre which pages you're looking at in exchange for a list of `What's related' links, but again it can be turned off quite easily.

Bottom line: configurability is the key.

Re:Netscape 6 is a branded Mozilla (1)

Rob Kaper (5960) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150012)

Other than putting the "N" instead of the lizard and changing the startpage [netscape.com] (which has some interesting migration info, check it) they didn't change a whole lot. It's plain Mozilla.

In fact, I was dissapointed by the amount of branding they did. I know it's only a preview, but I would've hoped to see the --installer convert more than my bookmarks. It didn't copy my Flash install and I doubt it even supports it. It hangs a lot on their startpage. not a good first impression.

I'll stick with 4.7x without Java for most tasks and the real Mozilla builds for the adventure.. this branded preview has little more to offer than Mozilla has.

arg! (anyone got a mirror) (1)

Thrakkerzog (7580) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150013)

You would think that NS would have a pipe as fat as the moon to this thing.. but I can't get to it.

Did anyone get it that can mirror?


-- Thrakkerzog

Re:arg! (anyone got a mirror) (1)

Thrakkerzog (7580) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150014)

hey, if you don't use the web page, and just use a console to ftp to their server, you get it much faster.

If anyone has some space, I can put it up somewhere. What is slashmirror's ip?

-- Thrakkerzog

Not posted from the Netscape 6 (1)

sanderb (9539) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150020)

Are they kidding?

I just installed it. The footprint is small, but not very small (11 MB without mail and news or Java). But this program is just to slow to release to a general audience.

I'm by no means an expert, but this looks a lot like Mozilla. It is insanely slow. I have a Pentium 166/64 MB with NT. Not a top-machine, but e.g. IE5 runs on it without problems. Here, if I go past the menu's it takes about a second to build them.

Within 15 seconds I found my first bug. If you ask for a secure site when it isn't secure (accident on my side), like https://www.yahoo.com/ it has a progress indicator for a while, after which it simply ends.

But the speed, or lack of it, is what kills it for me. Am I too cynical or demanding. The strange thing is that the HTML renderer panel is really fast, why did they not use it for the entire user interface?

Does anybody know what is supposed to be new about this thing anyway? I opened an xml-file but nothing spectacular happened...

this is a very, very good thing (1)

joshy (9772) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150022)

i realize that some people don't like the way netscape has been handling the mozilla project, but all open source efforts need to build up
critical mass and get some legitimacy before lots
of people jump on board. now that there is a
real preview version that the average person can
use i think we will start to work ramp up. and we
can let the fun begin. and it also means that people can start coding against the new standards
and have a legitimate complaint that MS doesn't implement the new features.

No Proxy Support? (1)

nuxx (10153) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150024)

One complaint about the Netscape 6 PR1 web-based installer... No proxy support. I can't seem to install NS6 on the nice fast pipe here at work. Uggh. Oh well...

-Steve

Anyone tried it on Win98? (1)

voncheesebiscuit (10243) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150025)

Has anyone tried running this on Win98? I
did the full install and when I try and launch
the app, nothing, and I mean nothing, happens.

Just curious of anyone else has had similar problems...

Mirror! (1)

Ian Pointer (11337) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150029)

here [man.ac.uk]

Re:Erm... yeah (1)

Tim C (15259) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150050)

Erm, this is a preview release, right? That's "preview" as in "beta" as in "don't expect it to be 100% bug free"?

Perhaps we should wait until the official release before criticising it for its bugs...

Cheers,

Tim

Re:Howz it werk? (1)

surfsalot (15319) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150051)

apache does the same thing

I need to do my laundry
Please send $3 to:
Jon Allen
p.o. box 308142

Re:Why has this been released? (1)

Asim (20552) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150064)

Um, IE5 works on Windows, Slowlaris, HP-UX and MacOS.

From my understanding, the Solaris port wasn't -- it was "move lots of Win32 API's over and run IE slow and buggy on top of those".
If I am wrong, I am sorry.

Re:netscape 6 bloatware (1)

Asim (20552) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150071)

It's not bloated if you want!
Choose Custom install. You can choose to install anything from just the browser to the whole shebang. It's good to see that, esp. since it was nigh-impossible to turn off in the 4.x series...
One of the nice things about the small "kick-off" program is that you can choose to install just what you want w/o having to download it at all. I'm not really a fan of these types of programs, personally, but I have to admit that feature comes in handy.
Check it out before you crap on it, friend! :)

Re:Erm... yeah (1)

Asim (20552) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150072)

Even better....go to http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/ [mozilla.org] . There's a whole tracking system for reporting bugs on the browser, built with Open Source tools!

I've used it myself -- it's not easy easy (like the Talkback for the Windows browsers) but it's complete, and you can not just report, but also track the bug as it gets fixed.

They don't just want you to use it, the developers ENCOURAGE you to reports bugs. That's what the nightly, M-series, and Preview releases are for...to do something proactive about bugs before the final version is out.

Everyone grips about bugs. With Bugzilla, you can DO something about them. Isn't that the Open source way?

Re:Why has this been released? (1)

Asim (20552) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150073)

Also, it works on MacOS and (more importantly) Linux x86 -- making it a cross-platform solution, something MS has yet to do.

Re:Netscape 6 is a branded Mozilla (1)

Asim (20552) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150074)

Well, true it's not much different than the Mozilla versions. But it's not here to be different. Why reinvent the wheel they just rode in on?
And, it you do a Custom install (2nd nature for me with any program, after too many years of being burned), you'll see it comes with Flash!
I, for one, DON'T want to see a lot of branding. And I doubt you'll get much. Netscape/AOL itself is depending on selling Customing kits to Big Business, letting them do their own "branding"...

Re:For those with Firewalls.... (1)

emc3 (22477) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150078)

Ahhhh, thank you. You probably saved me at least 10 minutes of poking around trying to find it myself (already checked the FAQ, but of course, no mention of how to download from behind a firewall there).

Now, let's go check out Chromezone....

--
Ernest MacDougal Campbell III / NIC Handle: EMC3
Got Spam? http://spam.gunters.org/ [gunters.org]

Really small download? (1)

FascDot Killed My Pr (24021) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150084)

10+ MB? Oh yeah, that's tiny.
--

firewall (1)

jrs (27486) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150086)

Anyone know where i can download a full package? Or does the *cough* Smart download have a proxy setting?

bookmark problems (1)

pixelbeat (31557) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150090)

The feedback form just returns "internal server error"! Maybe it's overloaded :-(

Anyway the problem I was trying to relate was:
For duplicate folder names within the bookmark
hierarchy, they're displayed incorrectly from the
bookmark menu.

When the folders were selected, multiple duplicate
folder entries were displayed for one of the
duplicated folder names.

Re:Howz it werk? (1)

schon (31600) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150093)

Here's one:

IT DOESN'T

At least not for me.

Downloaded the file, installed it (it dloads up to 11MB during installation) and when I try to run it - nothing! the little "Netscape6 Loading" window pops up, then goes away - that's it.

I tried running it from a command prompt, just to see if it spits any error messages - nope! You'd think that a beta version of something would at least give you some hint as to why it fails...

All in all, I'm pretty disappointed. Time to go look around the site to give them some feedback...

Re:Why has this been released? (1)

Junta (36770) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150098)

One thing about Netscape, however, is all the proprietary, royalty laden stuff they put in that mozilla simply can't put in. That is why Netscape will be released. Many people want basic third-party extensions to netscape that mozilla, by nature, cannot include..

Re:netscape 6 bloatware (1)

legoboy (39651) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150105)

why does netscape have to add in the other junk when one don't want the stupid junk as the AIM and such.. I think the user should be able to disable it from it or they can have AIM as a seperate thing.. netscape acts like M$ adding bloateware...

This sort of thing is why some of us click on "Custom..." which lets us "customize" our installation.

------

Re:New paradigm (1)

Hard_Code (49548) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150115)

Actually the menu says Ctrl+...but none of them combinations seem to work.

Re:No Binaries for other *nix's!!!! (1)

NetJunkie (56134) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150124)

Well...Yes, it can be a lot of trouble. Remember that Netscape has to support the browsers they release. To release on another chipset requires testing and validation just like they do on the x86 chipset. Maybe if enough people email to complain they'll see it's worth the effort.

Re:What exactly is Netscape 6.0? (1)

rit (64731) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150136)

For the record, and AOL Has mentioned it several times (Steve Case, as well as other execs):
While AOL Owns Netscape, they will not ship Netscape with AOL As long as their bundling deal with Microsoft stands.
Basically the deal MS and AOL have is that as long as AOL packages IE as the default browser with AOL, Windows installation will place a nice little AOL icon on the user's desktop - this is viral marketing and supposedly has worked very well for AOL - they aren't about to lose this ?wonderful? source of new business.

I don't think that AOL questioning Netscape's stability and product quality has any play here.

-Brendan

net2phone (1)

burgatron (65985) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150138)

it looks very nice. It is still a little buggy. I dont wont this nettwophone feature..and whats with puttin these extra bookmarks in my personal tool bar folder.

Burgatronics [burgatronics.net]

If AOL uses it . . . (1)

ProfDumb (67790) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150140)


Isn't the key question whether AOL, in the future, standardizes on Netscape/Mozilla for its users?
If AOL users all use Netscape, then IE can't be
considered the sole "standard" and web sites
might actually have to adhere to *real* open standards.

Re:Why has this been released? (1)

TummyX (84871) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150172)

Um, IE5 works on Windows, Slowlaris, HP-UX and MacOS.

Re:Howz it werk? (1)

PaulK (85154) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150174)

Right off the bat:

Fonts are still broken.
Lotta ram comsumption; it doesn't NEED to leak.
On resize, the contents did not grow/redraw properly. After a restart, it worked ok.

Hmmmmm... It is SO damn pretty.

You guys/gals have come a long way. Thank you!

(This message posted with Netscape 6 Preview 1)

Remove the "target=_blank" tags in those URLs (1)

Gene77 (90233) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150182)

Sorry about that... it seemed to happen after I posted it... it looked fine in the textarea box

For those with Firewalls.... (1)

Gene77 (90233) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150183)

Here's a directory containing the full install as a 16 MB Windoze .exe (since I insist on installing it at work):
ftp://ftp.netscape.com/pub/netscape6/english/6_PR1 /windows/win32/sea/ [netscape.com]

Or more directly:
ftp://ftp.netscape.com/pub/netscape6/english/6_PR1 /windows/win32/sea/Netsc apeSetup.exe [netscape.com]

Enjoy!

Finaly! (1)

bflong (107195) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150203)

It's about *#@($ Time. Great work folks! Hopefully this will be the cure for Netscape 4.x's memory leaks that have me so pissed off.

Slow FTP at first, but worth it so far (1)

BlckKnght (114099) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150212)

Well, the web link to the ftp site is incredibly slow, but doing a console ftp to the site gets it very quickly. It is very fast so far at rendering slashdot, and no serious bugs to report (unlike the last few night's with mozilla...). I strongly recomend getting it, at least for a test run.

congradulations to the Netscape team on their release, and the Mozilla people who wrote the code (mostly but not entirely the same set of people). Keep up the good work.

Steve

Fast Mirror (1)

ebola-zaire (122422) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150229)

The Netscape ftp servers appear to have died... I have mirrored the it on my server: ftp://ftp.c-60.org/pub/netscape/ [c-60.org]

mirror: http://snafu.de/~kl/netscape6/ (Linux) (1)

Kaspar (124682) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150235)

I am currently mirroring it at http://snafu.de/~kl/netscape6/ [snafu.de] . I hope you will be able to fetch it w/o problems! This is only the Linux version! Bye, Kaspar

mirrors? (1)

borud (127730) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150239)

do any mirrors carry it yet? I'm having a hard time fetching it from the FTP server at Netscape.

-Bjørn

Not as a web designer (1)

bildstorm (129924) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150241)

As a web designer, I'm really not happy with Netscape 6, at least in its current form.

My main gripe, I guess, its lack of support for DHTML. Layer support is one thing, but being able to do something with them is always nice. Take a look at Dynamic Drive [dynamicdrive.com] and see how many of the DHTML scripts you can get to run.

If you get more than one, I'll be amazed.

Re:Really small download? (1)

Salsaman (141471) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150257)

Bear in mind that a lot of that is stuff like Java which is not really part of Mozilla proper. Mozilla itself is currently around 6.5M

Hooray! (1)

TheNightAngel (146636) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150266)

Well, I'm posting using NS6 =) It choked on the first run on my machine (p200 64M RH6.1) but once I made it past the introduction screens and onto regular web pages she seems to be sailing smooth. Aaah, now all we need is a real time translator for M$ Windows Media formats and we're set =) The Night Angel

Re:Standards compliance (1)

kel-tor (146691) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150267)

neither browser renders html to the standard. Amaya is suspose to. Opera says it does. But the big two pushed their own agenda's durring the war.

And speaking of Netscape's non-compliant blink tag, what about the marquee tag in IE?

Re:Howz it werk? (1)

Rico_Suave (147634) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150271)

Nope, that's just your typical Slashdot FUD, with no basis in fact.

--

Thoughts on Netscape 6 (1)

mheckaman (149644) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150276)

Well, I'm happy (I think) to report that it does run seemingly well under FreeBSD 4.0's Linux emulation. However, are they not supposed to be fixing memory issues, not creating more?

[somewhat snipped data from top]
PID SIZE RES WCPU CPU COMMAND
6755 27212K 21768K 39.79% 17.97% mozilla-bin

6641 15072K 12172K 2.85% 2.64% netscape-4.72

[Note; I did not run them at the same time.]

Call me a M$ traitor if you wish (even though I'm solely dedicated to FreeBSD) but I would be very happy for a linux copy of MSIE (to run under FreeBSD's Linux emulation) - Netscape did NOT lose 70% of the market share because M$ bundled MSIE with Windows, they lost it because M$ sadly made a better browser, don't you find that sad?

PS: These are personal opinions, send your flames elsewhere please. Thank you.

Re:Howz it werk? (1)

fedos (150319) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150279)

Both IE and Netscape (4.x anyway) can "transmit" information about your system to requesting sites. They can also give personal infromation you provide under the respective user information screens.

Howz it werk? (1)

.Natalie_Portman (150870) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150280)

Any reviews yet? From the Urban Legends File - I heard M$ IE transmits all kinds of sys info if you log on to one of their web sites. Stuff like OS, apps, etc. Any truth to this?

Re:Erm... yeah (1)

skinhead (152780) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150282)

>Who wants to upgrade to more bloatware when >previous versions of the browser worked better. >Fix bugs, don't add more annoying features that
>slow things down.

Nobody wants to upgrade to something that doesn't
work, but believe it or not, there are some of us
who actually like progress. I don't seen anything
wrong with adding features (_if_ they can also be
turned off) while fixing the bugs already found.

If everyone would just be happy with what we
have and fixing bugs in existing software, Linux
would not be what it is.

Netscape Sucks (1)

fatguy64 (156221) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150291)

Everyone knows that Netscape sucks balls. IE is slightly better, but is not good either. The best browser is Opera. If you're not using Opera, you're either not at your own computer, or you're stupid.

Now with Enhanced Trolling Capabilities!! (1)

SmellyCarney (160389) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150293)

The "Killer App" all of us Trolls have been waiting for! What would this godsend be called? Why the refresh button of course! Refreshing Slashdot.org until you get your shot at 'first post' have never been so easy!!! what's that you say, Netscape has always had a refresh button? ............ oh, damn. you're right. nevermind.

Not only That, but . . . (1)

drachenstern (160456) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150295)

it refuses to do anything but call Dr. Watson to come over and play on the screen when i try to install, so does this mean it will Blue Screen when i try to d/l and install it on my win98 @ home?

how does the linux install work? very fast? hope it will go better than this M$ WinBloz NT Install even attempts to pretend to go.

Hoping to get flamed for this (don't ya just love troll msgs?)
-drach

Re:Why has this been released? (1)

FRAKK2 (166082) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150301)

Its been relased becuase we need competiton in the industry. If Microsoft is left with the only broswer in use then Microsoft will ditate what the standards are, this will mean in the long run that we will all be shafted. Also seeming as its still has some 40% of the Market its hardly died out has it?

netscape 6 bloatware (1)

haroldh (168403) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150306)

why does netscape have to add in the other junk when one don't want the stupid junk as the AIM and such.. I think the user should be able to disable it from it or they can have AIM as a seperate thing.. netscape acts like M$ adding bloateware...

SWEETNESS (1)

PseudoVampyre (169692) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150308)

even though mozilla is gone, this means it is considered somewhat stable. I Like!!!!!!

Netscape 6 (1)

DjDanny (171472) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150315)

This is the best piece of software I have ever used. Keep it up!

Download assumes no HTTP proxy (1)

Piobaireachd (171496) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150317)

I'm behind a big firewall, and I am not able to tell the setup about my proxy configurations.

Re:No Binaries for other *nix's!!!! (2)

HeUnique (187) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150329)

Hey, this is a PR 1 version only!!

Rest assured, that there will be binary versions for ALL unices - Sun, SGI, SCO, *BSD, etc..

Those guys at Netscape got those machines you know :)

Re:Net2Phone == Bogus (2)

HeUnique (187) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150330)

From what it seems - looks like you need Administrative rights to install the Netscape 6 with Net2Phone

Same old same old :) (2)

hawk (1151) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150334)

But then, we've usually had to use shift-alt-arrow, since X intercepts alt-arrows under most configurations. Then again, with a different window manager, you might use the default alt-arrow. But if you use KDE, you're in trouble because it doesn't seem to like you using netscape in the first place, and you don't get *any* arrow key motions.

And using the brackets may be reminiscent of the switcher on the mac--switching between virtual macintoshes before the multifinder. Come to think of it, I think I used it after the multifinder, too, to save memory . . .

THe download came at about 100k/s the third time. The first two were at 80. If you use netscape3 to download, it takes the file and tosses it into the ether without saving it or prompting you; I had to use a shift-click. And there doesn't seem to be a 128 bit encription--I fired up netscape yesterday for the first time in weeks to try to access vanguard; I don't have much use for netscape now that I have lynx launching new instances of itself . . .

Re:Damn these installers! (2)

Malc (1751) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150338)

For a lot of users it makes sense. If you don't want Java 2, why be forced to download all 7MB of Sun JRE? I kinda like it, and I would have desparately wanted in the days when I was still connected via a modem.

This is something IE has being doing for a while. However, IE allows you to specify that you just want to download and not actually install. Then you have all the components so that you can do an install without hitting the web.

This is a preview release: give them time to iron out the issues. They'll need to get it as smooth and slick as IE, and then it'll be fine.

Before you non-x86ers Freak Out (2)

Outlyer (1767) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150339)

Remember, you can get the source from ftp.mozilla.org and compile it for whatever you want. Don't complain just because Netscape's preview doesn't support the MIPS processor released in 1985 that you just can't part with, just go, compile and be happy. Is running ./configure && make reallu that difficult?

Uhh, Hello? (2)

kerz (1799) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150340)

Mozilla is not nearly dead. This is Netscape's preview release of their derivative of the Mozilla tree. This build was pulled weeks ago, and the new Mozilla builds include much more functionality now, IMHO. What has been released is the BETA of the NETSCAPE feature set for Mozilla. This is not a Mozillla beta, just a Netscape one. Hope this is clear, because if you give the impression that Mozilla is 'dead,' that would not be good.

Widgets (2)

Hrunting (2191) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150341)

I hope Netscape takes advantage of the theming capabilities of Mozilla and actually themes their browsers so that they look like the OS they are intended to install on. One of the major downsides to Mozilla (IMHO) is that they don't use the native widget set, effectively introducing another layer of complexity into the GUI which will probably end up confusing the end-user more than anything else. The easy decision now would be to make the Windows version have a default 'Windows' widget, the Mac version have a default 'Mac' widget, etc.

In terms of coding and portability, yes the current implementation is probably the best, but the end-user doesn't think in terms of coding and portability. They'll see Netscape 6 and think, "Oh, God, it made Windows look different."

Grrrr (2)

tgd (2822) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150343)

Okay, I've been using Mozilla for over a year -- and as my primary browser for quite a number of months...

But I really hoped that Netscape 6 would have waited until they had a freakin' drop down for the address edit box... I *hate* not being able to pick and choose from other URL's I've been to recently!

It DOES do DHTML. Beautifully. (2)

thomasd (3336) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150344)

They've worked very hard on standards-compiliance. The cause of confusion is that they've implemented the W3C's DOM level 1 (and most of DOM level 2 now, I believe). Netscape 4 used an old, proprietary DHTML system. Up till now, DHTML authors have generally used `browser-sniffing' code, and write one version of the page for Netscape and another for IE (which already uses DOM level 1). Right now, a lot of developers haven't updated things to use the W3C DOM with Netscape 6. Don't worry, it will come.

So long as you're careful, it should be possible to write standards-compliant, cross browser DHTML which will work (without browser-sniffing) in at least IE5+ and Netscape 6+. Problems in the short term, but really this is great news.

Re:But have they sped it up? (2)

Alan Shutko (5101) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150347)

No, the UI is still bog slow. (And ugly as hell, of course.) Moving the mouse along the menubar, the menu draws can't keep up with my mouse movement. It's as if my computer were in power-save mode... except it's not.

I can't even maximise the window to fit my whole screen.

Sure, it renders HTML fast. Too bad it can't render itself as fast.

What exactly is Netscape 6.0? (2)

Rob Kaper (5960) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150349)

Is it Mozilla, repackaged? I doubt that.. Mozilla is getting more stable and stable with every milestone but I wouldn't call it a beta yet (especially now that CSS rendering has been fucked up in the latest nightly builds).

I guess NS 6.0 includes some components of Mozilla, most noticably the Gecko renderer, but not all. Plus of course there'll be tons of old NS code to handle Flash, Java, etc etc. About 4Mb of overhead (comparing the 10Mb download to the 6Mb Mozilla download).

Oh well, I'm sure most of *us* will like it.

More important will be the public acceptance and attitude. And whether AOL will finally use Ns/Gecko in its products. How compliant IE 5.5's Tasman *really* is (the Netscape article on DevEdge [netscape.com] seemed a tad biased.

Even if this won't pull Netscape out of the dark, it would be nice if we could start developing websites without compatibility hacks. That alone would be worth it IMHO.

I'll be back when wget tells me it has [100%].

Mac version (2)

banky (9941) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150356)

The Mac version is nice.... Takes a friggin month to start, but its nice otherwise. Wish it had more of the native widgets; I get them on my Linux machine, why can't I have them on my Mac??

You MORONS! (2)

Bad Mojo (12210) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150363)

1) Netscape 6 is built on top of Mozilla. If Mozilla went away today, there would never be another Netscape.

2) It's a small download ... for a network install program.

C'mon. Let's not post stupid ass articles full of half-truths and hateful suppositions. It's obvious from the person who submitted this news that they don't like netscape.


Bad Mojo

Re:New paradigm (2)

EricWright (16803) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150365)

Maybe it has changed (I'm using the 03/23 build that someone posted a link to last week), but my menu says ctrl-[ and ctrl-] (I'm not smoking anything right now, thank you very much!)

But no, neither of those options seem to be working...:(

Eric

Observations (Windows) (2)

BilldaCat (19181) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150370)

Clicking on the back button doesn't bring up a list of pages.

Like it has been said, bookmark management has gotten worse. Hope that changes.

Looks like composer still can't handle frames, but maybe that's a good thing. :)

Mail appears to be able to handle multiple pop3 boxes finally. I would test this, but when I'm flipping through help searching for information on some new features, it takes over my current browser window in which I'm writing my Slashdot post.

I HATE THAT. Help should be built into the application, it should not require visiting a web page - and if it does, let it spawn a NEW window, not take over my current one, which I couldn't go back to by hitting the back button for some reason. Macromedia is guilty of this as well.. first place I saw do it. :\

It IS fast, though, even on my horribly crippled machine here. :) And I do dig the look of it..

20 minutes without a crash so far, which is more than I can say for 4.7 on my machine.

howto turn off comet thing? (2)

mwillis (21215) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150374)

Whoa! the comet thing has gotten kind of "loud" since the last nightly build. How do I disable this?

Re:Damn these installers! (2)

pfft (23845) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150377)

What happened to the days when you just download the setup EXE, run it, and the software was installed???

For that matter, what happened to the days you simply downloaded the program you wanted as an EXE file? :)

Re:Netscape 6- First Looks (2)

kmcardle (24757) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150378)

Does it leak memory? After an hour or so, three windows were using 45K of free memory, slowing my meager 64K laptop to lots of grinding.
Dude, even my trusty Apple //e had 128K. I'd recommend getting at least a meg or two. :)
Memory has gotten pretty cheap again.
--

Re:Sullivan skin (2)

EisPick (29965) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150382)

> looks basically like a Mozilla nightly build
> with AOL crap thrown in

At least it allows you to opt out of installing the Instant Messenger, which the 4.7 installer obliges you to install.

Seems fairly stable for a "preview release." It only took me a few minutes to crash it, but it seems a lot closer to feature complete and stable than the last Mozilla build I grabbed.

Re:Small download - because... (2)

Wah (30840) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150384)

PS While they're at it, can we do something about that annoying SmartDownload program that shows banners?

Welcome to the wonderful world of AOL.

--

Re:Netscape 6 (2)

infodragon (38608) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150387)

In case of the slashdot effect I've set up a mirror [shadowtechllc.com] of the Linux 2.2 version. I have limited bandwith so I limited the active http connections to 15.

Enjoy!

Sullivan skin (2)

Hard_Code (49548) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150391)

Ok, I downloaded the preview release, which looks basically like a Mozilla nightly build with AOL crap thrown in. The gui is identical. However, upon checking Alphanumeric I see that have a nice new skin called "Sullivan". It makes the browser seem a lot "fresher".

But have they sped it up? (2)

wowbagger (69688) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150396)

I've tried about every milestone release since M11, and they have all run like Windows on a 386SX.

To clarify: they may render pages quickly, but any attempt to do any kind of configuration takes several tens of seconds to get the screen up. This is on a Celeron-400, RH6.2beta, and 256M of RAM!

I've done several clean installs, I've pulled every trick 12 years of being a professional software engineer has taught me, and my results are consistent. Either I keep making the same mistake or something's rotten.

Anybody have good response time doing configuration?

Netscape mirrors... (2)

Mr. Penguin (87934) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150402)

Guys trying to download this, I suggest that you use one of Netscapes many ftp sites:

ftp1.netscape.com

ftp2.netscape.com

ftp3.netscape.com

ftp4.netscape.com

ftp5.netscape.com

ftp6.netscape.com

ftp7.netscape.com

ftp8.netscape.com

I pulled it off at around 500k/s. Try one of those and you'll be happy!

Brad Johnson
--We are the Music Makers, and we
are the Dreamers of Dreams

No Binaries for other *nix's!!!! (2)

naasking (94116) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150403)

Why does everyone insist on posting binaries only for x86 *nix's!?!? Sure, most of the boxes out there are x86 based. So what? Would it really take that much effort to compile/cross-compile it for another chipset?
-----
"I will be as a fly on the wall... I shall slip amongst them like a great ... invisible ... THING ... !"

Annoying Ad Tracking (3)

Gleef (86) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150412)

Going through the website at the link provided won't let you download the beta unless you accept a tracking cookie from ads.web.aol.com. It looks like you can do an FTP download without cookie tracking from:
ftp://ftp.netscape.com/pub/nets cape6/english/6_PR1 [netscape.com] .

----

I'm surprised nobody has brought this up yet... (3)

Sanity (1431) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150413)

...so I guess I will. Can Netscape 6/Mozilla allow Netscape to claw back the huge amount of ground it has lost to Microsoft. To those of you who use Linux or Unix exclusively this may not be apparent, but in the real world almost everybody is standardising on IE 5, not because Microsoft has stuffed it down their throats, but because Netscape 4 sucks. I would love to see a Netscape that I can use again without it crashing every five minutes, and hopefully Netscape 6 / Mozilla will be such a browser, but the real question is - is it too late?

--

This is certainly NOT the end of Mozilla (3)

thomasd (3336) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150414)

After a rather slow start, open source seems to have worked out pretty well for Netscape. There are some quite big community projects still going on (XSLT support, for instance).

I'd actually go as far as to say that the release of a commercial Netscape 6 will be the point when Mozilla.ORG really starts coming into its own. Just imagine: a commercial browser with millions of users, but still (almost) all the code out there for anyone to grab and hack on.

Methinks the future looks very bright. Now we just need a working OpenJava plugin for Linux...

Re:Skins.... (3)

luge (4808) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150415)

I don't know if they'll work with the netscape beta, but if you are using a nightly build of mozilla, you can get skins from Chromezone [mozillazine.org] . Since beta is nearly identical to the nightlies, these should work, but no guarantees from me. BTW, I strongly recommend Aphrodite and Sullivan- don't waste your time on the others (yet- classic could be really nice, eventually.)
~luge

Re:New paradigm (3)

luge (4808) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150416)

Just an FYI, in the latest nightlies there are no keyboard commands in the pulldowns. We'll see what that means, I suppose.
Also, in Mozilla, everything is skinnable- not just skinnable in the "I can make it look pretty" sense, but also in the "I can change it completely" sense. That includes keyboard shortcuts, menu layouts, menu content, etc., etc., not just getting rid of that horrific blue-green ;)
~luge

Damn these installers! (3)

Stiletto (12066) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150419)

RANT MODE ON

What is with these installers these days? You download a tiny instalation EXE which then in turn tries to download the actual software package. The hell with you if you are actually behind a firewall or proxy that the "smart" installer doesn't know about!

What happened to the days when you just download the setup EXE, run it, and the software was installed???

RANT MODE OFF

Anyway, if anyone knows how to install the Windoze version of this on a machine behind a proxy let me know!
________________________________

Ramblings on N6 (3)

EricWright (16803) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150421)

Lessee... two problems. ALT-[left|right] arrow have been replaced with CTRL-[ and CTRL-]. Years of reflexive training down the tubes. Also, manage bookmarks is next to useless. I can't drop bookmarks into a folder, open or closed. They fall either above or below the folder.

But, man, it sure is fast.

Eric, making his 'first post' from N6

How to avoid /. effect :) (3)

RPoet (20693) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150423)

ftp://ftpX.netscape.com/pub/netscape6/english/6_PR 1

Replace the X with any number from 1 to 8, and there you go.

Small download - because... (3)

Frac (27516) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150424)

The small download only includes the setup.exe file. The rest of the files are downloaded from netscape's FTP site.

From the looks of mozilla, the total amount to download should be around 6mb.

PS While they're at it, can we do something about that annoying SmartDownload program that shows banners?

Re:Small download - because... (3)

adimarco (30853) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150426)



Anyone know where I can download the *real* installer? I'm behind a big scary proxy, and the installer never gives you a chance to specify proxy settings, thus it can't download.

What is this bullshit anyway? I can't tell you how many installers I've had to abandon recently for the exact same reason. Why can't I just download the fscking software and install it myself, thanks?

Anthony

Comments from a new user, probably unpopular (3)

edremy (36408) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150427)

Well, I'm posting from Mozilla. (Sue me, I like the name Mozilla.)

Some quick notes: I started using the web back when beta versions of Mosaic were the height of sophistication. I used Netscape up until the 4.x days on Unix, NT, and Mac, when I switched to MSIE on both NT and Mac. Why? It was better, a lot better in some cases.

Mozilla Win32 impressions so far: not so great.

The activation script is hideous- lots of graphical glitches that remind me of student written X programs.

The browser overall isn't faster than MSIE5. Opening menus is slowwww- just scrolling back and forth across the menubar will cause the menus to lag. Opening/closing windows is also slow, at least compared to MSIE. Hopefully this is just debug code and the real Mozilla will be faster.

So far no crashes. Doesn't say much, but some of the stuff I've thrown at Mozilla would have already killed Netscape4.

Why, oh why doesn't Mozilla mark where I was in a previous document when I hit the back key? Why doesn't it copy MSIE's autocomplete function? Both are serious reasons I might not use this over MSIE.

Many of my old Java applets don't display correctly. This might just be my bad programming, but given my horrible memories of trying to get applets to function under Netscape/Mac I'm a bit worried.

The Chime plug-in doesn't work- it doesn't display anything. This alone will keep me from using it until it's fixed. (To be fair, Chime is a tricky plug-in- MSIE has had problems with it for years.) Have to send a bug report.

Thanks guys, for letting me kill AOL IM. I stopped using Netscape on the Mac the day a new version installed IM even when I told it not to.

Will I use it? Maybe, at least to check out sites I write. But it's not enough to make me switch for good on NT/Mac, especially since MSIE5 is out for the Mac as well.

Eric

No more Mozilla (4)

Squid (3420) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150432)

Oh the humanity. mozilla.org is down, the nightly builds have stopped, the source tree has been closed, and M15 is right out.

I am, of course, being sarcastic. mozilla shows no signs of going away just because a commercial distro happens to be on the release schedule.

Unless someone knows otherwise.

Netscape following Microsoft's lead? (4)

The Incredible Mr. L (26085) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150436)

More bloatware. Of course AOL owns them now so it's AOLware.

What is it with throwing everything into a web browser nowadays?
All I want is a web browser with java capabilities, security for on-line ordering, and ability for plug-ins (shockwave, etc) for multimedia.

I DON'T want integrated email.
I DON'T want integrated HTML editor.
I DON'T want automatic upgrades.
I DON'T want channels, subscriptions, etc.
I DON'T want messaging, chat, etc.
I DON'T want fancy schmancy crap.

Just a SMALL, STABLE WEB BROWSER to view WEB PAGES. NOT some totally integrated internet appliance software or whatever. Think I better learn to program now. What's the best language to do this in? C++? C? FORTRAN? hehehe

Seems like a resource pig... (4)

weave (48069) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150438)

I have it running in Windows 2000 now and it's consuming 32 megs of RAM all by itself. I grabbed the "leaked" version a few days ago and saw it go up to 60 megs of RAM (according to task manager). IE uses around 16 megs, although since "it is part of the OS" it's hard to determine how much of it's resources are accounted for "elsewhere."

I can't wait to get home to try it on my linux box and see how it rates...

btw, off-topic rant. I'm currently pissed as hell at Netscape for forcing longtime netscape web users to change their username [cnet.com] just so they can merge all of their account IDs with the same bloated name space as AOL. That means, stupid usernames like joe235753 for example... :( I had "weave@netscape.net" and now they want to force me to give it up. So much for my "lifetime e-mail address."

Netscape 6 is a branded Mozilla (4)

mpieters (149981) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150440)

Duh? Mozilla gone? What about M15, expected in about a week? What about al the hard work still going on at Mozilla.org?

Netscape 6 beta 1 is but the first branded Mozilla browser. It is based on Mozilla, as Stronghold and Red Hat Secure Server are based on Apache. It adds features, has it's own version of the UI (which is completely replacable, not just the pictures on the buttons)

Whatch out for more browsers based on the Mozilla core. Mozilla itself is aimed at the developer, but there will be 'easy' versions, kids versions, embedded versions, etc. Long live Mozilla!

You got it wrong last time with all the fuss about a discussion on security related bugs in bugzilla, instead presenting it as a decision. Please get your journalistic facts straight.

Martijn Pieters, Software Engineer
Digital Creations [digicool.com] , Creators of Zope [zope.org]

Not the end of mozilla (4)

Signal 69 (159601) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150441)

Netscape 6.0 isn't the end of mozilla anymore than Red Hat 6.2 is the end of Linux. You know that :-)

Netscape 6- First Looks (5)

peteshaw (99766) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150444)

First of all, this is listed as Netscape 6 PR1, so its not gold or anything. Its just a prerelease version of there normal buggy .0 releae.

It looks just like mozilla m14. This should not come as a surprise to me, but I didn't know what to expect.

Does it leak memory? After an hour or so, three windows were using 45K of free memory, slowing my meager 64K laptop to lots of grinding.

Otherwise, despite the ugly N logo replacing the cute Mozillasoar, it looks pretty solid.

A final word about the integration. I have a netscape webmail account that uses the name "peteshaw". I stopped using it some time back when I accidentally posted it once on the usenet and found I was getting inunspamdated.

When I started up N6, it went through this whole routine told me that I would have to change my easy to remember name to something abstract and bizarre to satisfy its corporate renaming requirements. I think Netscape is merging the webmail name lists with AOL IM Service, which is integrated with Netscape IM. So now instead of "peteshaw" I need to come up with PeteShawSpankMyMonkey or something long and stupid.

So far its just annoying, but after trying 3 or 4 times to come up with a reasonable username, it gives me this error "Too many logins from this IP address, please wait 24 hours before logging on." On top of that, the only button I have to choose is marked "retry". What's a guy to do? Sit here staring at the retry button for 24 hours? It wasn't that hard to eventually work around, but its like ??????

So, needless to say I am skipping the netscape bundle of features for now, or at least for the next 24 hours. I might just stick with M14.

Please folks, get this right. (5)

medicthree (125112) | more than 14 years ago | (#1150445)

This is the third time that slashdot has posted a story that got this wrong: Netscape 6 is NOT the final "Mozilla" browser. Netscape 6 incorporates some parts of the Mozilla efforts, but NS 6 is still a commercial product with proprietary code put out by Netscape Incorporated. Mozilla is not complete, and is still in testing. When it is finished, it will not be called "Netscape" anything, it will be "Mozilla." Please try to get this right.
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